"HERE WE GO AGAIN" ray charles
"FOOL ME ONCE, SHAME ON YOU"
"FOOL ME TWICE,WELL AH.... WE WON'T GET FOOLED AGAIN"
GEORGE W. BUSH
It seems we are about to go down that path again. AMP-OHIO is about to pitch another great deal to the city administration. This time an almost completed Gas-Fired plant near Fremont, Ohio recently owned by First Energy. The AMP-OHIO is on a tour to sell this to the AMP NATION.
Recently Cleveland Public Power was told that their share of the Meigs County fiasco would be 12 million dollars? 4 million could be "rolled into" [nice way to say hidden cost] Fremont Plant but they will also have to cut a check for the other 8 million. Soon Painesville will find out their numbers also.
Tom Sanzillo an independent auditor hired by someone in the AMP-OHIO group stated;
We don't know how the basic amount is determined. What the interest rate is or why it is what it is?
The linking of the transactions may be the best way to do this in the end,but its really not a good way to settle this. Everything is made sloppy and continues sloppy from the get go.
Tom, its called a "Take or Pay" contract. simple here we go again.
The same people that recommended Meigs County are still in power today. Rita McMahon and Joe Hada. I assume they will recommend this contract for God knows what reason. Mr. Hada made a statement during the Meigs County hearing All he wanted to do was in 5 years when someone sat down for Thanksgiving dinner they would have the energy to cook their turkey. Seems the only turkeys are people who receive Painesville Power?
Yes another take or pay contract.
Painesville water rates? I see $8.00 fee per 5/8 inch meter added to a resident bill [$96.00 a year] and $179.00 [$1148.00 a year] added to a six inch industrial meter. The average resident uses 500 cu.ft of water a month. So are they telling me Lubrizol uses the same amount of water as 23 households in a month? Aqua Ohio charges around $480.00 per 6 inch meter [$2160.00 a year]?
First off the flat rate stinks and what would happen if we raised water rates 8% for 6 years then continued at that rate for the next 9 years after that? Do you really think giving this administration another million plus dollars is a good idea?
With all these issue a POC meeting will be held Tuesday June 14 at 6:30 pm at Chester Restaurant. Meeting will start at 6:30 so please come in earlier if you want a bite to eat before hand.
A closing thought to our councilpeople.Why would First Energy put so much money into this project and sell it before even using it? Also dig deeper and find out who owns the transmission lines this electricity will be routed thru? If anyone tells you other then First Energy there not telling you the truth.
posted by terminator1 @ 10:56 AM
47 Comments
47 Comments:
New curbside recycling program to start in Painesville. Is recycling mandatory or do you have to recycle by law?
Theres no law thats says you have to recycle as far as I know. This is another "feel good solution" If your co-mingling who and where do they do the sorting?
Anything is better then that joke of a recycling center, don't you think?
There's all kinds of problems with this gas stuff, too. I forget everything that I read about it, but that could be why First Energy sold the project. I say no new ANYTHING until we hopefully get new council people in there who will look out for us. I say come up with the money to fix the water pipes that are causing trouble in peoples houses, and let the rest wait until we can trust what they are doing. I'm still ticked off over the stupid AMP landfill deal that powers one house a year - MAYBE, let alone everything else they got us into with AMP. I think we need to stop any and all rate hikes and any kind of deals whatsoever until after November. Then we need to get the line-by-line budget reinstated, too. I cannot believe they are even considering another AMP deal, let alone another take and pay. We need investigations around here. Investigations, investigations, investigations.
Let me get this straight, you have Never had anything good to say about the recycling center and now you question the co-mingling of the recyclables. I'm sure when the time comes and you have to pay the fees you will find that unacceptable too. What is good here and why do you stay? Just to be a pill in everyones side?
I'm sorry to write in this area as my question has nothing to do with this topic, but I couldn't find the original blog.
I attended the Cedarbrook area regarding the water problem, then had an out of town emergency so I did not get a chance to have someone answer this. My question had to do with a resident on Miller Ct. who has had an ongoing water problem. I thought I heard him or someone on council say the city did thousands of dollars in improvements behind his house. Did I hear this or did I misunderstand something. Anyone take notes that may have some information.
6:01 yes I heard the same remark made at that meeting about drainage improvements on Miller Ct. I don't remember a figure.
OVESS Anything would be an improvement but I outlined the best way to recycle in a previous post. My question remains when you co-mingle who and where is it sorted. Again this is a BIG improvement, only hope its done right. I stay to be a "pill" in your side. Good enough reason?
Lota great things here just have to put up with alot of B.S. to enjoy them. I know I will never convince you that I love Painesville.
How can you blame the city manager when council were the people that voted for the Amp deal? Seems you want to blame her.
I think the city had the best of intentions with the recycling center, but it was a mess. The broken glass all over the place threatening to ruin car tires was the worst of it as far as I was concerned. I also worry about animals that could step on the glass. I hope they intend to clean the area good before they call it a day there. The new recycling idea sounds great with wheeled carts with covers. Probably as ideal as it can get.
To the first poster who is probably not keen on the idea of recycling their own stuff, maybe I could add a word of encouragement. It can seem like kind of hassle or maybe too much trouble if you have never done it before, but it really is easy. Just rinse out all plastic containers numbered on the bottom from one to six, throw in your newspapers and cardboard (last I knew the plastic-coated pop/beer containers were not recyclable), and that's all there is to it. So just in case you have an interest, it is pretty easy. Or start small with just your newspapers or just pop cans/bottles if you drink pop.
Now, if anyone can tell me why companies who make the plastic containers, and have the entire bottom of the container to put in their triangle/number, make it so miniscule that it is almost impossible to see ... And you know how it goes - the older I get the smaller they are!
I guess I think its Ms Rita’s fault because our city government is upside-down….meaning the manager dictates and council follows instead of the way it was designed to be. And even that could work if the decisions were good ones….after all; she’s the one getting the big bucks for the urban college education. The sheep on council would never have voted for AMP – Ohio if the city manager hadn’t recommended it. Plenty of fault to go around.
Does this mean that AMP Ohio is finally ready to tell Painesville exactly what our share of the Miegs disaster is? Are we finally going to get a bill? Listen up council…a word to the wise. For those of you that haven’t bothered to do the research on your own, you have been repeatedly told what a bad deal ‘take or pay’ contracts are. In this economic climate it would not be a prudent decision to stay in bed with AMP Ohio. Cut bait and run ( not walk) away from them before the city is on the hook for even more money we can ill afford to lose. I guess it just sticks in my craw that the 2.7 mil that we DO owe them could have bought a lot of water pipe.
I agree with anonymous that the city had good intentions with the recycling center. It was the inconsiderate people that messed it up by dumping garbage and things that didn't belong in the bins plus dumping outside of the bins. Now for those that will jump on this to say "if they aren't empty, what should they have done". Take it back home and throw it away. Just because your trash can in the house is full you don't throw it on the floor, you put it elsewhere. Years ago when things were co-mingled the drivers on the truck sorted as they went. If not they sort at the recycle center. It all depends on the company. Why don't you call the company to find out and let us know the answer.
BTW - you are not a pill in my side,just more of an all-round general pill.
This AMP-OHIO mess mainly lays at the feet of Rita McMahon and Joe Hada. "They own it" with help from
follow the leader" people like Paul Hach and Robert Fountain.You wonder if either of those two ever had an independent thought. McMahon highly recommended it telling us half truths to questions I don't believe she even knew the answers to. Hada I remember "Proudly" vote yes to Meigs County Projectly. To those that suggest that maybe it was a good idea that went sour? To many people were telling them it was a bad idea from the get go. One other person that should bear some responsibility Law Director Joe Gurley. Did he even bother to read this contract. What were his thoughts? Painesville money will be spent on this and who should be held responsible? Maybe even with their resignations?
For once I agree with you. If Painesville loses a dime because of this Amp deal heads should roll. With Rita's first what were they thinking?
As far as the water fund, was the money ever payed back after the last financil mistake?
Yes, Term, McMahon/Hada, etc. had all kinds of people IMPLORING them not to do it. For starters, getting into a 50-year COAL plant deal at this point in time was just not smart in and of itself. In 50 years, I think we will all have our own little wind machines or something similar on our roofs. Then you add the take and pay. And if I recall, there were so many details that just didn't make sense, and did she ever even SAY it was a take and pay. I don't think that it was she didn't know the answers to these questions, Term - I think she was doing her lying by half-truths and omissions, and so was Hada. It's par for the course for them. I think these people need to resign or be impeached. And we need to get this done before we agree to any more increases in water or anything else. Let's get people in there that can be trusted to look at the damn books and try to see just what has gone on in this city since McMahon got here. It took - what? - a year or two to get her to even sort of admit that we were going to owe AMP money on this bad deal.
Term, this may be a good time to recap all the big blunders (with dollar amounts where applicable) that McMahon/Hada have succeeded in doing to this city of ours and to our pocketbooks. What do you say?
You may be right and as soon as people get their water increase and realize the city lost big money on AMP-OHIO and a few other issues maybe council will start receiving phone calls?
When the AMP Meigs County deal was pushed so hard you have to wonder why? A 50 contract? coal? take or pay? what was the motivation?
I received a comment I couldn't print due to language, but it was from an unemployed homeownwer in town who called the flat rate for water "socialism"? The arguement was in hard times he decided to water the lawn, flush his toilet, how often he uses his washing machine and now Joe Hada, and Lori DiNallo seem to want to punish him for conserving water? He made an interesting arguement. Claiming people are being punished for being homeowners in Painesville. With a thought on unemployement is it at 9.1% what do you think it is in Painesville could it be near 15% or over?
Water rates should be based on usage PERIOD. We already give breaks tohigh users. What are thesev people thinking?
FOLKS, YOU CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN THIS TOWN IF YOU WOULD ONLY COME TO THE COUNCIL MEETINGS AND SAY WHAT IS ON YOUR MIND. IN ORDER FOR ANY GOOD TO COME OUT OF THIS ELECTION IN NOV, IS FOR YOU, THE PUBLIC TO 'VOTE' FOR, MURPHY, TIBBITS , TO GET ON COUNCIL AND SHOW JOE HADA AND MCMAHON HOW A COUNCIL IS SUPPOSE TO BE RUN. IT CAN BE DONE AND SHOULD BE DONE TO HELP THE RESIDENTS OF THIS CITY. THE ONLY REASON TIBBITS AND MURPHY WANT ON COUNCIL IS TO HELP THE CITIZENS OF THIS FAIR CITY. IT NEEDS NEW BLOOD AND A NEW VOICE. SOOOOO, VOTE THIS NOV. A VERY CONCERNED TAXPAYER, WHOALSO WANTS A CHANGE.
I thought city politics was non-partisan? Seems Lori DiNallo wants to make Hine avenue a campaign stop for Jamie Callendar? Nice job Lori pig roast? Great idea for Republicans
First off Lori DiNallo can as a private citizen can hold a campaign party for anyone she wishes to.
I do and have no proof of this. I believe Lori has higher political aspirations than Painesville counci-at-large. Why not a run next year for County Commissioner against Robert Aufuldish?
I believe she could unseat him.
Unemployment and inflation going up again. Reports say teen unemployment is 24%. Housing prices in the sewer and the cost of our water going in that sewer is going to what double. No answers to the high rental rates or over crowed housing by some. Schools that seem only interested in attendance diplomas or having 5 valedictorians. Add AMP to that and we sure are going to have an interesting summer. Who is going to take the blame. I'm sure there will be many here to find fault. Wonder who will find some answers.
I thought I would look on the Painesville City School site to see if they had announced the new board member.
No news yet.
A thought some of you that complain about by spelling should look at how our schools spell "eligibility" well if you go to the board of education site you can see that the "elegibility" requirement must not include spelling skills. I guess being a Harvey graduate my speeling comes honestly?
I just had a conversation last night with a friend, and I was wondering how the kids get employment for the summer now with all the illegals here. Surely they are taking a lot of those jobs. With the above post about teenage unemployment at 24%, I think I got my answer.
As far as DiNallo goes, I am very unhappy with her on city council, so I certainly hope she does not have bigger aspirations. I feel she does enough damage on THIS level, and would hate to see her on a higher level.
Well a well educated Hispanic woman was hand picked for the school board Alyea Barajas wonder which direction our system will go?
God help us all!
Barajas doesn't seem to be a property owner in Painesville, let alone Lake County. So the decisions she makes on the Board that costs us taxpayers won't be costing her. This doesn't seem right to me. Where did she come from? What is known about her?
Well, why not a hispanic woman? She will be representing almost 40% of the student body...Too bad they wouldn't give serious consideration to anyone else though...Miss Abby Miller is a fresh INTELLIGENT face that knows the system well. Don't give up Ms. Miller....there is a place for you in local politics. They're not going to give it to you...you're going to have to force the issue.
giving recycling bins back to people in Paine seems like a program is going to be rolling out. Probably will start charging people some sort of carbon tax based on volume of recycling done.
Why don't we first give this woman a chance? Sure she might have been hand-picked, Also possibly a renter but she is awell educated womanthat chose to make Painesville her home. Lets give it a chance she might bring something new to the table.
Really it would be hard to make the situation any worse.
Yes, a Democrat can endorse or campaign for anyone they want, right 2:27. Republicans can't?
Yes, council is suppose to be non-partison. But all members belong to one party or the other except Hal, he is his own party. Just ask him sometime but be prepared for his usual long winded yes or no answer.
So, if Term is a member of this new PAC called the POC, can he endorse anyone he wants? Can You? Seems the only true way to be non-partisan is to not have any opinions or to never vote. I guess it is better to live in a dream world where voting for singers or dancers and idols is more important.
I see we added another D to the school board. Keeping it all in the family I guess. Hal switched to the Republican Party before he became a member of his own party. John Murphy switched from D to R too. Wonder why Term or anyone else would ever support him now. Is it much better to have all D's to run the city? That way you always have the R's to blame. What's more important? Is it political party or a person's ability or desire to do what's best for Painesville? I honestly believe that most here and in Painesville believe party comes first.
Term, think I am out of line? I would like to ask one thing then. When did the City of Painesville start it's current decline. What's different from when you were in school and growing up and what we have now? When did we go from a Mayberry type town to an inner city type small town? When did the schools fall so far behind our nearest neighbor, Riverside? When, what, or who brought all this decline? I have an idea but I would like to hear yours.
I for one, although it sounds prejudiced, do not think it is out of line to be worried when ANY hispanic takes any position of authority in the United States of America. We have sat by for years while hispanics overrun our country, and anyone who has been paying attention knows that 99.9% of hispanics care about the hispanics and not the U.S. Their only concern about the U.S. is that they want to be able to have their entire countries here. It is the hispanic people who have brought this on themselves, and we are wise to be weary. I don't know this woman, and I hope she will not just be looking out for the hispanics and what they can take/get. Sorry if I am misjudging her, but as I said, it is wise to be weary and foolish to put anyone in position of authority who is a Latino in the United States of America at this point in time, so I am with 2:30 and everyone else who is expressing concern.
I thought I mentioned she could do whatever she wants? The POC will endorse who is best for the city period. Your to wrapped up in this left - right thing its clouding your reason for reading the blog.
I believe you are in a minority about the R or D thing ruling Painesville politics. The number
"1" Democrat on council should resign. If I remember a councilperson well connected with the local GOP went on national T.V. claiming illegals were welcome in Painesville?
There's enough blame to go around.
3:40 Take the word Hispanic out of your comment and insert Italians, Polish, Irish, German, Hungarian, Japanese, Jewish.
I understand your concern but to just forfeit someone from serving on a government board over nationality... is showing your prejudiced.
She is American as much as you are.
Is your problem with illegal's {mine] or is it with Hispanics.
Why don't we look before we rush to judge? Please next someone will want to see a birth certificate.
Term 3:55. This is 3:44. No, it's not the same as the prejudices of the past. Those people were not here illegally and they were not overrunning our country by the millions. Yes, my problem is with all illegals, but my biggest problem is with Hispanics and I explained my reasons why. There are millions upon millions of illegal Hispanics here, and at this point, I feel I have every right to feel the way I do based on the advantage they are taking of this country and the damage they are doing. I stand by my statement. Am I prejudiced at this point? Yes, I think I am, and I make no apologies for it. I am not so foolish as to remain politically correct while my country is being taken over. How would they feel about Americans taking any offices in their country, let alone if we were overrunning them like they are doing to us. Oh, I forgot. We couldn't get away with this in their countries - they do not allow it. I have watched all the Hispanics on any panel, and in almost every office in the country that they are in, and they all look out for Hispanics first, illegals too, and they put their needs in front of every Americans and America.
TERM, you made a misleading comment. The councilwoman who went on TV in support of the illegals was a Democrat. She may now have changed to an R to help a friend get elected, but she was definitely a D when she went on tv.
6:11 I'm misleading? Tell me for who and where she was working when she made that appearance?
She could also be an independent?
Let's see now. The Hispanic population in Lake County is 3% and in Painesville it is 20%. This is what the 2010 census says. So, we have a little over 6900 Hispanics in the county but almost 3800 in Painesville. That means we have over half of the Hispanics living here and 55% of the counties Hispanics. Nationwide population of around 55 million and reported 11 million of those undocumented means we could have over 760 illegal immigrants living in Painesville. Not as many as some assume but way to many for our taxes to support.
Term, I have one thing to say about both sides are to blame. With you, I am always waiting for the other shoe to drop. You say both sides are to blame and then add your but.......this R did that to the end of your statement. Most here know your political views and I don't believe they are as non-partisan as you want us to believe. Just my opinion. We may agree on some things but disagree on others. One thing I do know is that our votes count the same.
The other shoe didn't drop, just stated a fact. If a Democrat made the newscast I would have said the same. I guess I'm mad a Democrats for even embracing illegal immigration. Then I watch Republicans become hipocrites about the issue? Who's driving this issue people that want more Democrats or businesses who want cheap labor and increase profits.
TERM, are we talking about the same person on tv? A D was a democrat when she was on Fox. Are you talking about someone else or do you really not know that she was a democrat then?
To 7:06: Just a few thoughts. I don't believe the 2010 census even came close to counting the illegals in this country, including the Hispanics. How many of these illegals actually stood up to be counted. If I was a thief in someone else's country, I certainly would not stand up to be counted. And just for the record, I would not be a thief of someone else's country. Also, the government has been saying 11 million illegals in this country for decades. The Mexican government said several years ago that they estimated that there were 20 million illegal Mexicans in the U.S. They said they had the ghost towns to prove it. I believe them. And that is only the Mexicans, not the rest of the Hispanics, let alone all the illegals from the other countries. My guess is that there must be at least 11 million illegals here from NON-Hispanic countries alone. I think we would be shocked at how many were here in Painesville.
Actually if you dig deep enough to find who is holding up real meaningful legislation it is both parties. Dems want the votes they get from "helping the latinos" and r's want the labor advantages because they get the business money for re-election. What we need as everyday citizens is for both parties to work together and solve the problem instead of asking the first question of "what advantage can we get from it"?.
I know the person you and Term are talking about she's a republican?
Just so everyone knows, it was Abby Delamotte that went on Fox and stood up for the illegals being here, or said she loved them here or whatever stupid thing she said.
Yes, it IS both the D's and the R's fault that the illegals are not out of here. It just kills me to hear them talk about the deficit, etc., without mentioning the millions and millions of illegals in this country who are draining us in a million ways.
The key to this now is the E-Verify, and Obama is supporting it (!) apparantly. Also the courts just upheld Arizona's right to shut down businesses who knowingly hire illegals, I believe. It's 95% of the battle right there. Take away their work, and they will leave on their own. We need to hurry up and get a Temporary Guest Worker program in place, however, for agriculture only, to address that problem. Ohio Government - where ARE you?
Yes, she is an R right now, but only recently. She was a D when she went on Fox.
Earlier, the City Manager said we had $2,700,000.00 million dollar in "stranded cost" now we have only $2,000,000.00 in stranded cost due to the Meigs County failed power plant. I guess she saved us money we never owed. If she were Painesville School Super they'd giver her a stipends. I'm not sure what to believe other than it's time for an independent third party to get involved!
To 3:04: McMahon is probably going to sneak the other $700,000.00 out of the water increases. Maybe that's where the rest of the higher usage rates went.
I wonder if our bill went down to 2 million, provided that we sign up for Fremont. And if we don't sign on the dotted line....... then is it back to 2.7 million?
To 4:39: Geez, I hope you are not right, but you COULD be. And it would be just like McMahon to leave that little tidbit out.
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