"DO YOU WANT TO KNOW A SECRET" beatles
This Replacement levy the Painesville City Schools has put on the November ballot seems to be one of the quietest issues in a long time. Sometimes, when in conversation, I mention the school issue I am greeted with a puzzled look and a "what levy"?
The only advertisement I have seen so far is in the back of the Harvey High School Football and Fall Sports Program.
Inside the rear cover is the full page Ad.
YES ON ISSUE 3
It's For Me!
A REPLACEMENT OPERATING LEVY
Vote YES
ISSUE
3
Tuesday, November 2
Polls open 6:30 a.m. to 7:30pm
Absentee Ballot applications available now at Board of Elections, Morley Library
or web at www.lakeelections.com
Painesville City Local Schools.
This along with six photos of students in different activities at school. Along with paid by citizens for Painesville City Local Schools.
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Is this informative enough for you to decide on this levy?
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Now a another secret, an ad hoc committee is in the exploratory stage to oppose this levy.
My advise to them was don't be against the levy. Do your homework and act as an information group to Painesville taxpayers. Here is their proposed first ad.
Are you a Voter?
Are you Aware of Issue 3?
NO on Issue 3
Sorry it's not for Me!
The school board wants to replace a 6 mil. property tax for Painesville Schools in November. It sounds like a renewal but the facts show under the current 6 mil. levy, we pay $34.22 on $100,000 home
Under the new REPLACEMENT levy, we will start paying
$180.97 when are property tax bill come due in February.
An added $146.75 a year.
What will this additional $950,000 assessed to Painesville residents to be used for?
This is a lose,lose for all of us!
Painesville sadly is presently the LOWEST ranked school system in Lake County. With the lowest graduation rate and test scores!
The arrogance- more taxes in this down economy!
The system in place is failing our children and more money is not the answer!
Vote NO on the Painesville Schools 6 mil REPLACEMENT levy.
"Money cannot guarantee success, it only beautifies failure".
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Is this too "negative" or "mean spirited" a statement?
posted by terminator1 @ 6:37 PM
41 Comments
41 Comments:
Money cannot guarantee success, but denying needed funding CAN guarantee failure.
The only information in the school's add was that was worth while, absentee ballots are available now.
NOw I can go down and vote NO.
Correct 8:42...but when the schools were already adequately funded, their scores were dismal...so why increase the direct burden on taxpayers? I realize state funding has been cut and there needs to be a combination of cuts and new revenue just to keep things as they are...but I really have a problem spending more money and getting less in return. The school board was short-sighted in asking for this size levy...that's probably why its a stealth campaign, hoping it will pass because voters won't really know how much it will cost them. They should have considered asking for a smaller millage...they would have had a better chance of getting it passed.
Lowest education scores in Lake County....asking for more money.
Less bang...more buck!
I'm voting NO!
Nothing about the levy, but on a positive note...did anyone see the NICE article about PCFD in the News Herald the other day?
Since not much positive appears here I thought I'd be the first to toss it out there.
Now is not the time to be asking for such a large tax increase from the poorest community in Lake County who is already paying one of the highest property taxes in the county. The School Board ad is misleading. People think a renewal means they will be paying the same amount. That is why this is being kept quiet. So taxpayers don't find out how much more they will be paying. This is outrageous.
This is just one more sneaky, manipulative maneuver from this city, as I see it. Let them come out and be honest with the people. Until then, I vote no. I think that at the very least, the citizens need to do an educational campaign to let the unsuspecting citizens know what the school is pulling. Outrageous.
Vote no, let it go! For years now, it has been stated time and time again that the entire administration of PCLS needs to be replaced - regardless of being pro/anti levy. How many complaints against board members have been on this site alone? The people have not had the power to make this replacement happen. Let it go - the state will come in at some point and "clean house" if the test scores, grad rates do not improve. At any rate, the students of PCLS will not be without schooling - they just may have a new group of people to run things - ultimately what the residents want. (yes/no?) It might even be what the teachers want. What could it hurt? No one seems to be satisfied with the current situation.
It would be nice to think the News-Herald would do an article on this, but we all know that won't happen and most people won't know about the levy...
Term.
Your facts are wrong about the amount, you need to recheck them
Please explain, where did I make a mistake? I want correct numbers to be used.
I used the formula that I was given?
To 5:25 I beleive these board positions are elected? People have the chance to elect new members every two years. If things are so bad why is it the only challenger in the last election was Steve Costell? He worked hard to get votes but in the end the incumbents were re-elected. I thought Mr. Costell should have been appointed to the board when Mrs. Hada resigned only because he put himself out there to be elected and truly wanted the job. Where are all these people that want a change? Everyone better remember we got what we all voted for.
Painesville City Local School District — 6 mills replacement levy, CONTINUING PERIOD OF TIME, commencing 2010 tax year, first due in calendar year 2011 — current expenses (News Herald)
So, this secret, higher priced, replacement levy will continue on forever. (It must be one of the eleven)
• Currently have eleven (11) continuing and one (1) five (5) year current operating expense levies on our tax duplicate for Collection Year 2010.
• 5-year levy expires 12/31/2013.
• For Tax year 2009 our effective Class 1 rate is 28.62 mills.
Term, can you figure out what 28.62 mills will cost the owner of a $100,000 house?
I bet it is a lot.
Info from presentation to BOE by Dr. Hanlon and Treasurer Rick Taylor
Looks like I have another phone conversation in my future.
Tell mer is everyone as confused about this as I am. I did the math and I came up with a figure I don't presently want to share.
Something to think about....
All I ever hear is Painesville needs retail?
Now be the guy who wants to build a 10,000 sq,ft building for a grocery store in our town what would that building be worth and what would the taxes be on that building? Cheap utilities?
Has anyone started the committee against the levy yet? I want to donate some $$ and help educate people about what is being requested. At a minimum we need people working the polling locations handing out fliers with the facts printed on them.
This is 5:25. I agree about Steve Costell. He is a very nice guy. He should be on the BOE! It seems though, that the voting pool in Painesville is NEVER enough to overturn things in favor of change. If everyone wants a change in personnel, then why are the same people always at PCLS? Where are all of these voters that want a change? I guess talk is cheaper then action. I stand by my first post. If the residents do not want to pay more $ to PCLS, then vote no and just let things go as they will. PCLS will either have to step up and show improvements or the state will come in and find people that will. (I'm sure there are some unemployed people out there with administrative skills that would like to be working again.) The students will still be schooled no matter what happens and that is the most important thing. PCLS just received almost 1 mil to be used for retaining/recalling teachers. They have only laid off support staff - no teachers. The $ will not be used to recall those support staff as those job positions were totally eliminated. Let them utilize that $ BEFORE asking the residents to further enable them. The election will be interesting this year. Ahh...venting is good, but I think we all know how it will turn out...prepare to dig down in your pockets a little further :(
The Board of Education has placed a Replacement Operating Levy on the November 2nd ballot.
The following is a list of frequently asked questions concerning Issue 3.
http://www.painesville-city.k12.oh.us/protected/ArticleView.aspx?iid=5G3U2B&dasi=3GPI
I see the city has another 5-year plan. Whats that the third one in the last 3 years?
Talk talk talk, Cathy Beiterman talks and nothing substancial is said. Who were the people chosen to be on that committee?
All I know if this bunch was planning the D-Day invasion Eisenhower would still be sitting and waiting in London. We pay good money for this?
I have been told its the law that we must educate illegal children and children of illegal's. Fine but they will receive the state minimum Not another penny. The White and Black children have suffered enough having their educations disrupted by people who shouldn't be here.
I will sleep well at night thank-you. How much does PSLC pay out in translators. They should be the first to go. Along with my screwed up councilman and his bus.
In reference to the Painesville Schools so-called Renewal Levy: Not, it is a replacement Levy of a very very old Levy. A Levy way back in History that (as all levies) can only collect their funds based on the taxable property values of the year that it was passed.
As this is an older levy, they just want to pump-up to an increase on the current taxable values of your property: buildings and land.
The previous Dollar amounts posted on this blog are wrong! Everyones increase will be based on the Auditor's office figures of the Taxable numbers on your property values. Not everyone's Taxable Value will be the same. Using $100,000.00 as an example is a farce!! If you can find and show me a $100,000.00 taxable value home in this city, I will be totally amazed!!
The numbers previousely provided are based on our Home in Painesville. The $34.22 tax is based on the many year back when this levy was approved: as provided to us by the Lake County Auditor's Office. The New figures for this 6 Mil Levy are also guranteed figures provided by the Lake County Auditor's Office.
Yes will now pay $180.97 per year, which is an increase of $146.75 dollars per year.This increase represents an increase percentage of at least 81%.
Go to the Lake County Auditor's Sight and find the taxable Value of your Property. Do the Math. Call the Auditor's Office (Barb) and she will tell you what you paid in the past and also help you with the Dollars that you will Pay in 2011.
I have never lead any of you down a negative path.
Remember in 2005 the Charter Amendment Levy that would have devestated the bottom line of every home-owner and business in this City??
Charterlady/Former Government Finance
Slowdown Mr Term. your comments are "too negative and mean spirited". The BOE could not legally appoint Steve Costell to fill Mary Hada's position because Steve never applied for the position! The [8/2/10] rumor about Board Member Kalb moving to the township had no merit. Please Mr. Term do your homework.
Charterlady please do the math on a $100,000 home and post it here.
If my figures are to high let me know if there to low also. This just proves how complicated this is repacement renewal.
6:55 what rumor on 8/2 about Rev. Kalb?
8:55, how do you know who applied for what positions on the school board unless you work for them or are one of them?
Also, are you expecting all of us to believe that the recent resignations, and subsequent selections were not known in advance (hand picked)?
There is very little that happens in the PCLS that isn't leaked by people in the administration who have loose lips.
On August 2, 2010 it was rumored that Kalb was moving to the township, read the blog. Why not ask Steve? Why not research before you print? and now you want us to trust Term's fantasy math!
I'm still having problems finding that Rev. Kalb was moving out of the city. I thought he was moving to Casement Ave?
Steve probably didn't want to subject himself to that process again, I will ask him. Sorry, I agree with a poster that the last two on the board have been appointed by current members. Steve probably will wait until the next election and get elected honestly by the voters.
My figures are fantasy math?
Well Councilman Flock solved that problem at his next Town Hall meeting.
Finance Director Mr. Taylor will be present to answer all questions the residents will have. Again this is not a pro levy or against the levy. Mr. Flock got Mr. Taylor to come and explain the numbers. More details as I get them.
Fantasy Math? Seems to satisfy most. theres a lot of fantasy in Painesville already. SOLUTION I will appoint some people and do a 5 year plan for the blog.
Concerning your five year plan for the blog: Make sure it costs a LOT of money and accomplishes nothing, or there will be no comparison. Oh, and make sure it figures out how to lose a hospital, too.
Whats wrong around here is some people are to stupid or lazy and just want to complain about what you post. How has it become your responsibility to hand fead everyone in Painesville? First they complain about the levy then they complain about how your trying to explain it. Next thing they'll want you to drive them to the polls? What a crew!
The following represents how anyone can figure your tax increase from the 6 mil School Levy in November.
On-Line or a phone call to the County Auditor's Office.
Find the taxable dollar amount of your buildings and land. Taxable amount is 35% of the listed Market Value. Move the decimal point 3 spaces to the left. EX: 34,470.00 (TAXABLE VALUE NOT MARKET VALUE) = 34.470.
Take this figure and multiply it by 6.0 = $206.82. Take this figure and multiply it by 87.5% = $180.97.
The tax amount that you have been paying on the old 6 mil levy does not appear on the Auditor's sight. You must call the auditor's office to gain this figure if your taxes are being paid by your escrow account with your Lender. If you pay your taxes direct, the tax amount will be on your tax invoice. In this case, the taxable value today is the 34,470.00 and the taxes are $34.22. The new tax assessment will be $180.97 which is an increase of $146.75 per year.
We can take this same formula for the Lakeland College Issue 1.
34.470 x's 1.7 mil = $58.60 x's 87.5% = $51.28 new tax to be paid. Current taxes paid are $8.37 per year.
I tried to explain this as simplistic as I could. By all means, contact Barb at the Auditor's Office and she will give you your data and guide you through this process in order to obtain what both of these Levies will cost you in the near future.
Charterlady
As all press for any new levy or replacement levy uses a number of $100,000.00 for their numbers, they never state that they are using the Actual Taxable Value of your Buildings and Land. Big difference between the
Market Value as Listed for your property and the Taxable Value which is 35% of the listed Market Value at the Auditor's Office.
As $100,000.00 always shows face, I will now give you the figures if this is really a taxable property value.
100.00 x's 6.0 = $600.00 x's 87.5%
equals $525.00 per year.
As I have never found one property in P'ville that has an actual Taxable Property Value of $100,000.00 - I have to Laugh at the Ignorance of anyone in P'ville Gov't, City Schools and yes Lakeland that would use this Value in reference to Painesville City.
I just say it like it is!!!!!
Charterlady
Charterlady.
Term you and Charterlady can argue about formulas all you want. If this levy costs me 2 cents more I'm against it.
To 9/25/10 4:08P
I am not in pursuit of any argument with Term - nor Anyone.
As in 2005, I am just presenting the factual math and numbers of Reality. I do this because I see that the Painesville Schools and Lakeland College are publishing a whoa is ME and advertising confusing stats to aid their purpose.
Tell the real truth and base your numbers on the True Taxable Property Values instead of using the Benign $100,000.00 figure. I have to say again: Find me properties in Painesville that have a Taxable Value of $100,000.00
not a proposed Market Value as stated in the Auditor's office values. If you rent where you live, the increase will be 100% on the owner of your property because they do not receive the 12.5% reduction by the state of Ohio. This percentage is only granted to residential owners and owner occupied properties. This 12.5% is not given to them nor any business or manufacturing industry.
Our property for the school levy shows an 81% increase in taxes (actually close to 82%) and for the Lakeland Levy it is a flat 83%Just read an article today in the News-Herald that the Painesville Schools are having a difficult time in providing Instruments for all of the Students that want to play in the band. They are now asking for help from all of us for this. When I was in School, for this extra "C" activity, my parents had to pay and provide the instruments for my sister and myself?? Since when should everbody shell out money for a select few?? If your child wants to play an instrument, then it is your responsibility to purchase what they need.
Painesville School system is planted in the lowest per capita community. Stop trying to feather yourselves as you are equal to all other schools who have brilliant academics and outstanding records. This school system can't even gain 1/4% of the requirement mandates.
50% grading Policy has hurt those who are upper-grade as they are being turned away from 4-Year College Admission. Shame on this School System. Shame on Hanlon who always looks for the easy way out to Satisfy the Mandates.
Down with Hanlon - and Let Those of True Knowledge manage and budget for the good of all.
Charterlady
I'm with 4:08.
We can all argue about numbers with Term and Charterlady. Here's the figure everyone should be concerned about how many people in Painesville even know about the levy? We all complain about the leadership of the schools but they seem to be running a very valid campaign to pass this. Term has called it a stealth campaign its a pin point campaign only people who they know will vote yes are being notified. The question is what will we do about it?
Again, there are no arguments about numbers! These are being provided so all of you are informed and hopefully you will do the grass root process of passing these on to your neighbor, who will pass this info on to their neighbors - etc etc etc!!
The School system is low-key with this and so is the News-Herald.
Anon 7:43 am - the providing of the stats is a mighty way to pass-on to those that do not know. One problem, those that do not know do not care and will not pursue anything that is posted here, in the News-Herald, or in the Tribune. Because you and others have read the numbers; the only hope that I have is that you will go forth and do an assist job to make others aware of what is buried for the November Election. After all, your statement that we should be concerned about how many People even know about the Levy speaks for itself. Obviousely this might be important to you - so go for it! Do your part to pass this on and educate those that do not know!!! You will be amazed at the comments you receive: but, you will also be amazed at the thank-you you will receive for
standing-up with your advisement of what they have missed or do not know.
Challenge to you, to satisfy your own question as to "What will we do about It?"
Provide and pass-on the fact of this Levy. Provide and pass-on the numbers provided, as they are just one example of the tax increase.
So much on this sight is based on the minorities. This Levy is not race related, it is an open-eye to ignorance and mis-management in the school system. Not just with financial problems that have never been addressed: but, also to the improper management of the learning process that has been diluted to satisfy the Federal and mandated State take-over of the schools.
You 7:43A posted to this sight. Get-Up and Go-Out and spread the Word as all of us have accomplished before. All of us still walk the walk and talk the talk.
Thanks!!
Charterlady
Charterlady,
Thanks for your clear explanation on this school replacement Levy and how we can find out what we actually will owe if it passes.
Do you know how many levys the school has all together?
Bond issues for the school are different, yes? Like for the new school construction.
What are the total taxes we pay to the schools in 1 year?
I guess, what I am asking is what do you pay for the year to the schools in taxes?
Thanks
I plan to attend Andy's townhall meeting, but I must confess I was disappointed after Andy's meeting with Painesville City Electric Super Tom Green. I was more confused about the power adjustment cost after the meeting than before it started. I hope this meeting in informative and not just a celebration that somebody from the city actually showed up.
You and everyone else that attended that meeting left confused. Did you ever think thats the purpose of this confusing formula?
All I can tell you that be prepared with your questions for Mr. Taylor. If you don't understand stop and make him explain. Check out the school site some of your questions may have been answered.
Anon 9:49 AM
It is 9/28/10 and I will do my best to discover what this household pays in school taxes for the one year period.
As our taxes are paid via our escrow account with our lender, we do not receive any type of breakdown.
As soon as I can, I will contact Barb H. at the Auditor's office and ask her to provide the levy and bond breakdown and the tax figures for each item.
Charterlady
That kind gentleman that spoke at the town hall meeting is paid over $90,000 by the city. Sly like a fox if you ask me.
Suggestion: ask about ALL the taxes you are paying through property taxes.
What about the library tax renewal? Will our taxes go up because of it? Does anybody know? I'm so sick of their banking hours, I'm ready to vote no on that, too. Plus they refuse to have a pay phone on the premises for people who do not own cell phones.
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