"ANTICIPATION" carly simons
One word brought up 'unofficially' at Tuesday nights special council meeting was the word
'RECIPROCITY' now to make this simple lets say you live in Painesville and work in Mentor. You pay Mentors 2% city income tax and Painesville thru reciprocity gives you full credit to the income tax you pay Mentor and you would not pay to Painesville Income Tax. It was mentioned at the meeting that only 38% of city residents pay Painesville City Income Tax.
Now lets say council can change the reciprocity to only 87% ,75%, 50% or even 100% five people on council could after three meetings change the game where you might pay a percentage of your income tax to Painesville. Here's the rub. Mentor still wants it's 2% and you could be paying in total 2.5%, 3%,4% total in city income tax.
This is an election year and yes you could pass the levies or not, but lurking in the background council could change the reciprocity.
The people running for council should let residents know how they would vote on reciprocity.
Since the administration shows very little interest in cutting expenses. Maybe its time to sell something?
Lets find out from an independent source the value of our water department. I for one could careless who delivers my water to me.
If the administration is steadfast on not examining cutting costs it is up to residents to find them the money.
The POC has asked the city to show us the present health care cost and contributions to the city made by city employee's.
I guess what most of us want are the same things. good roads, and safety forces. The argument seems to be is how to get there.
As with the water lines decades of neglect roads now seem to be on life support. Maybe if the administration had made better use of resources in the past we wouldn't be in this situation.
Finally the chickens have come home to roost.
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To some of you who might be curious that our Main St. Project can receive the CBDG grants for the last two years. Well it seems we are an non-entitlement community?
So according to all the acronyms, CBDG, HUD, CAPER, LMI.
Our administration considers the Main St. project for grants by addressing it as slum and blight.
Which I will add my acronym NUTS.
posted by terminator1 @ 7:29 AM
24 Comments
24 Comments:
This is something that I hope ALL the City residents pay very close attention to. Make sure you ask each of the candidates to state EXACTLY where they stand on this issue.
Term is 100% correct in that people who live in the City, but work elsewhere, could wind up being clipped for 4% (or more) of their income as a City tax.
This was driven home to me when I lived here but worked in Cleveland Hts or Shaker Hts. Neither of these cities has reciprocity so you wind up paying 2% (or whatever)where you live and another 2% where you work.
BTW, I always come back to the fact that our ancestors fought a war over the idea of double taxation. Why is it permitted now??
I might point out that, assuming only 38% of City residents pay the City income tax, it might be because there is VERY little in the way of business in the City. You can't get a tax from people who are not employed.
However, to counter the City's viewpoint, I might point out that the City is collecting income taxes from people who live elsewhere and work here. Someone who works in Painesville but lives in Madison still pays our tax. Additionally, people who live in a Township get clipped for 2% in the City even though there is no income tax in a Township.
That doesn't even address the JEDD where people who worked in a Township get ripped off because the City and Concord Twp collaborated to lighten their wallet.
In the end, the 38% of City residents might be accurate but it does NOT tell the whole story.
This has been POOR fiscal management for a very long time and it is biting us in the butt now. Remember that at election time.
I have said it here before and will say it again, the Ohio system of municipal taxation sucks and is a detriment to development in this state. Several months ago you and I disagreed on the house bill to fix some parts of the municipal tax system. You bought into the line from Painesville on how they would be hurt which was largely bullcrap as the city was spouting their case made up mostly of myth.
Reciprocity was not a part of that bill but boy it sure should be as more and more cities are moving away from full reciprocity. The cities are as bad as all our government entities in their never ending search for more revenue and not focusing on how they spend it.
11:15 Yes Reciprocity was NOT part of that Bill.
I agree 100% with your statement that their is a never ending search for revenue and not focusing on how they spend it.
Where do all of our council people work? Somebody? Anybody? Mr. Fodor and Mr. Hada are both retired.Correct? What about the other 5? Do they work in the city?
1:35 Are you suggesting Retirement income should be taxed the same as other income taxes?
Hey Term how much has the City cut the operating budget since 2004 when the safety levy failed. Also how many employee positions have been cut since then?
These tax grabs by every government entity is beyond ridiculous. Figure out a way to cut expenses! As for the JEDD, I don't even understand how that is legal. It all seems like a big scam to me.
No offence but that retirement income has already paid city income and state income tax when it was earned . To relax would be double taxes on fixed income. One works in the city and one in Cleveland. I not sure of the third one. Part of cities proble is the state cut off cities from monies that they got and that shorten the general funds, now they have to find replacement monies . That is not the cities fault ,no control over the state. The Judd is a chance to replace the loss of the hospital . Having people who work pay taxes takes some of the load for theses who live here. We need to get more people working inside the city.
3:33 Since 2004? When was $250,000 spent to buy useless land along the Grand River off of Richmond St.? When did the city decide 'Hey we need an assistant city manager?'
When did the city take general fund dollars to fund the Main St. organization? How many poor deals has the city got involved in since 2004? There's more.
4:51 Retirement income double taxed? What then would you call income tax paid into two different cities? Double taxing people is not the answer the state keeps the tax money and now we must do
double tax us again?
The governor as well as the representatives have caused this. Now think about who's in charge?
NO - I wanted to know where they worked and how reciprocity would relate to them? Which work in the city and which do not?
Just one works in the city the other does not. I am not sure of Lorie I think she retired from the schools
Just one in the city the other does not? There are 7 people I believe. I didn't think Ms. Dinallo had enough years in with or was old enough to retire.Come on Team Terminator - What's the answer to the question?
Hey term I asked a question on number of employees and budget cuts. You didn't answer me.Your starten to sound like a councilman already. Answer the question wwe already know the reteric.
5:08 All that will come out. First if a person retires and you don't replace them what does that tell you?
The city spends close to 80% of the general fund on wages and salary, What does that tell you?
Lets wait until they put the levies on the ballot. Then you will see reteric.
Look for the most part Hada and Fodor are retired and work off and on. Fodor probably will end the school year at Maple.
Katie works in Cleveland, Lori works for the Lake County Court in Painesville. Hach works for his father and that business is either located in Painesville Twp. or Fairport. Flock works in Highland Hts. pays their income tax and I believe a half percent to Painesville. DeLeone works for the county in Painesville. I'm trying to understand your point?
I guess Hada and Fodor are off the hook along with DeLeone and DiNallo and probably Hach. Meaning only Katie and Flock would pay double. Oh, I see where your going now.
Most service occupations do have the majority of cost in labor. but you still diverge from the question how much of the budgets were cut and how many positions does the city have now as compared to 2004?
7:42 I guess a short answer would be not enough. Think you have a 12 million dollar general fund budget and you set aside $150,000 for major road repair? Is this good management? less than 2%?
Read what income tax revenue was meant to do.
We will let the people decide in November.
Now as far as the safety levy. Where do the E.M.S. funds the Fire Department collect's from insurance companies go?
We didn't collect those in 2004.
Are the department heads being paid at 2004 rates? CM also did we even have an assistant city manager? Why do we even have an assistant CM. Monday nights council meeting council will be asked to approve supplemental compensation to our assistant city manager for serving as CM for the past couple of months. Wonder if they will mention or if anyone asks the amount he is currently being paid and how much of a supplement they want to reward him with?
You can argue all you want I've lived here over 20 years and no way should anyone vote to give these Bozo's another dime.
Term I challenge your 80% of the general fund goes to wages as I know that part of the wages in the utility dept. are paid out of the three utility dept. also the fiancé director,the CMs ,assist. CM ,and most others in city hall.the city has cut back on full time employees by replacing with part time with no benefit employees.that includes switchboard operators,court security officer,deputy clerk,bailiffs.some of the building dept. and rec. employees . But it seems funny that none of that Evers appears in this blog
6:27 The numbers come from this years Budget. Where do you get your numbers from?
Whats seems more FUNNY! than this never appears on the Blog. Why does it not appear on the city web. site? CH12? Painesville Pride? City Newsletter? or anywhere in the media?
Term actually the City or School board will never cut enough or do enough to make you happy because your just unhappy. You also want everything for nothing. I dare you to be positive for a month. Bet yiou can't.
3:50 What makes you believe I am unhappy?
No I want a reason for not getting what should be expected.
Positive for a month? So is your idea to be positive is just to ignore what you see in front of you?
3:50 Just wants you to shut-up so that within a month everything will be perfect again.
Look you are nothing but a messenger but people don't want to hear the message?
Where does the fear of the truth worry some?
true you are probably most happy when you are complaining.Sorry for the misspeak.I was trying to get you to look at yes there is problems but there are some good things too. I know nothing good with the city.
4:26 What makes me the most happy is positive results.
Yes there are good things as well as many good people in Painesville.
I guess my main problem it seems is when people ignore problems or better yet cover-up them.
Can Painesville continue on it's present path?
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