"COUNCIL MEETING MONDAY 02/02/15
Excuse me for being late. A little under the weather earlier this week.
Now to the council meeting. There was no agenda items at all none, zilch, zero. nada.
Different topic did come up. I asked for an explanation of our electric bill. Since I have always been told the (PF) or (PCA) was the difference between the amount it cost's us to produce power and what we purchase on the open market to fill the city's power needs. Since we don't produce electric power isn't the whole bill the (PF) ? I used the analogy if a gas station advertised a gallon of gas at .99 a gallon plus the PF of a $1.00 why even mention the .99. Someone needs to explain. Presently Painesville is purchasing 30% of it's base load power from the most expensive source in North America (PSEC) and we also have an agreement voted on by council to purchase power from AMP-OHIO for $69.00+ for the next five years for I guess another 30% of base load power. Both deals presently cost a whole lot more than can be purchased on the open market.
I also asked what the manpower at the inactive power plant costs the average metered customer being served by the City of Painesville?
I guess I should have asked if residential customers are subsidizing huge industrial users, but we will never know without transparency.
Where did and who paid for the 2.1 million dollars sent to AMP-OHIO for Meigs County come from. Did that cost us ratepayers any money?
Has any of this had an adverse affect on the city's credit rating?
I guess what my problem seems to be is with all these poor investments and other things going on how do they find the balls to shutoff the power for a residents nonpayment?
*I expect to hear that we have a diversify power purchases and the plant workers at the power plant aren't costing customers anything. Good, if they don't cost us anything there are many unemployed Painesville resident presently unemployed if it cost us nothing hire a couple dozen more.
A presentation by the electric department will be made at the next meeting.
Ray Sternot asked the administration if the city had a street maintenance program to keep streets in good order between major resurfacing a subject the former assistant city engineer brought up at two previous council meetings.
Randy Bruback gave a department presentation on what improvements and training along with new equipment being used at the Waste Water Treatment Plant. He mentioned in passing that the plant as well as the electric, and water plant all are equipped with AED defibulators as a safety precaution. He also mentioned all electric line trucks as well as fire trucks are also so equipped.
After the meeting I mentioned to the police chief how many defibulators he had. (I assume his officers probably in many cases are first on the scene. His answer none? As a matter of fact he told me none of the patrolmen are trained in first aid or CPR? When I asked why I was told an EMS unit was only 90 seconds away. So if you suffer cardiac arrest make sure your near a electric department line truck.
We were told the wrong cylinders were ordered for our absent Tower truck and now we are hoping for it to be back in-service by the end of February.
This situation seems to be an unending story. I think maybe myself and others are being a little harsh on the fire chief. He seemed to have been sent on an impossible mission to provide Painesville-Concord with a needed piece of fire equipment with a budget that you aren't going to get to much with what both communities wanted to spend. They probably got the best deal they could. It's like you being sent out to buy a used car with a $1000 budget and then people wonder why you have transmission problems. Let's hope this purchase ends on a positive for both communities.
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FYI Today's News-Herald finally reported on the new 9 million dollar water intake to Lake Erie voted on in the January 20,2015 meeting. I brought this up at a Town Hall Meeting and wondered how it will be paid for? Councilman Fodor explained it will be paid out of the temporary $8.00 surcharge on your water bill. to the tune of around $450,000 a year for the next what 18 years? But what about replacing water lines ? Well we collect close to a million bucks a year so we still can fix waterlines. Ever get the impression this was the reason for the surcharge from the start?
posted by terminator1 @ 5:30 PM
43 Comments
43 Comments:
Some where there is a great defibrillator salesmen. They are popping up all over. And you MUST be trained on its use, or you are useless.
The ops just call the squad. They are law enforcement, not medical. Ask one.
Conversation changes to illegal immigrants in
5, 4, 3, 2, 1.
Temporary means forever in the Ville'
shut up about that fire truck already
Sorry its ridiculous to think that PPD shouldn't be trained ion First Aid and CPR. Not there job? Protect and Serve.
7:14 Fire truck getting under your skin, wonder why?
10:15 Something council should look into?
The fire truck thing didn't work out well. They were trying to get something they needed? And they tried to save a buck and it didn't work out? Did they break a law, was it gross incompetence?
If the fire leadership is incompetent, ask for their resignation at a council meeting. Did they break a law? Ask for their resignation at a council meeting.
If it was such a total big deal, term,just ask council for an executive summary of the whole "fiasco." Ask them flat out does someone have to "go" because of it.
Actually, term, your play by play of this story makes me feel bad for the fire department. I wonder how much ridicule they get from their management and fellow city employees.
4:16 No so far it hasn't worked out to well. No I don't believe the leadership is incompetent or broke any laws. Probably used the best judgment they had.
Is it a big deal? Who decides this? The "fiasco" was to look for an impossible deal. Maybe to resolve a future issue a third-party should have been used to check the apparatus out? ( A true expert in that field)
Bottom line the truck has been out of service as much as in service.
Play by play makes you feel bad for the fire department? Who would ridicule them? They had nothing to do with the purchase. Maybe some would be upset because a valuable piece of equipment is not at their disposal.
Just my take. It seemed odd to me that the solution to Painesville-Concord equipment needs could be found in a 23 year old truck.
Yet we can hope.
Your being to generous in your assessment of the fire truck. I believe the money spent is just the result of this bogus purchase. The actions of the two chiefs have left both areas without their own fire truck. We had a functioning vehicle and replaced it with one that is out of service more than in service.
Maybe the smart move would have been to keep the older truck until the bugs were worked out to the one purchased?
The ridicule should be placed on the experts we believed not the firefighters.
That 8.00 fee was always thought of to get the new inlet into Lake Erie.
No our water cost's more then the rest of the county.
Our utility departments calculate fees and rates different then everyone else's.
I'm confused...when did your vine or mine close? I see a for sale sign in the window.
4:16 said:
I can only surmise that the city bought the truck because the FD said they need it. And I also surmise that management asked the FD for recommendations. So WHO suggested the used truck. Was it city management or the FD?
After listening to you, TERM, report and report on this truck, I'd like to know WHO made the decision instead of blaming the whole city government. Are we just jabbing our FD guys in the ribs for the Blunder, or are you out to really GET somebody?
Like 7:14 said, enough about the truck, were stuck with it for now.
Do you feel a little vindicated with the story about Prairie State power plant in todays News Herald?
10:45 No not really my only wish is that the powers to be take this situation more seriously. AND quit telling us it doesn't cost us money!
2:06 If we needed it, which we do where is it? I don't know who decided to purchase the truck. Only that council paid for it because of recommendations of "experts"
jabbing who in the ribs? Look we were told the community needed this truck and now it's out of service more than in-service. I guess after many other "blunders" council should be a little more careful on what they agree to i.e. Meigs County, PSEC,Windmills, the Rita McMahon Battery Box building, streetscape. An antique fire truck seems to be the least of our many blunders
12:42 The building is for sale not the business that operates there.
This place has bigger fish to fry...Who is paying the wages of a downed electric plant? Street-scape Money down the toilet. Hospital and high school site still sitting vacant. Roads - POS, you need to have a tank to make it without damage to your car. AND Shame, You are implying there was arm twisting (jabbing ribs) to purchase a fire engine? Please. You just always have to find someone to point fingers at. Someone said it before -it was a joint venture. Not just ONE person did this. Now why dont you blame the manufacture of the parts for the vehicle?
5:45 All your complaints are valid. Shame? I didn't imply anything I question if it was a wise purchase. Joint ventures don't mean crap. 68 Ohio communities bought into PSEC doesn't make it a good deal. Simple rule from kindergarten your mother taught you "if Billy jumps off the bridge, you should too?"
This fire truck seems to have a life of it's own.
I can't believe the Police Chief told anyone the the response time for EMS is 90 seconds! Are you sure you heard it right? That would be the lowest response time in the State of Ohio. It is a shame that PPD doesn't have basic First Aid training, CPR training or AED training. I was told that the state Health Department offers a free antidote to heron overdose and that Painesville Police said no thanks. It's no wonder the Police Levy failed [Fire Levy and Road Levy passed]. 90 seconds away! The CM and Fire Chief better set him strait.
You constantly listen to hearsay of others yet you refuse to go directly to the horse's mouths with your questions. Why? Because as you said before, you wouldn't believe them in the first place. They would tell you what you want to hear not the truth. On that note, why do you snake around behind backs and publish incorrect and untruths? Are you aware that someday your foolish comments could damage a career or cost someone a job? Example: (red electric truck sightings)Those guys get breaks by law, is it really your concern where and when they take them? You are jeopardizing people by your nonsense.
12:20 snake around and publish incorrect and half -truths? Look I didn't spend 20 minutes at a Shell station then proceed to a closed road (86) by St. Mary's Cemetery hidden around a bend for another 45 minutes. Look if it's legal why are we hiding? If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, chances are it's a duck. Wonder who was worried about their career that day? Why bring this up now this is over a year old. A tip to the wise many people have camera phones. Maybe that's why some hide? At least now it doesn't look like a power convention at Redi-Go.
11:41 That's what I was told by the police chief. Maybe it's a Union thing between the PD and the FD? Either way the question needs to be asked WHY? in a public forum.
You proved my point about asking questions and posting answers. Agree with 11:41 why did you ask the PPD a question about EMS. You have your wires crossed. I also do believe that the drug for heroin OD is available and carried in Painesville. Wait, tomorrow I will do some homework and get an answer on this and I am calling fire dept to find out about this truck chatter. I'll get to the bottom of it since it sticks in your craw and you can't pick up a phone. I'll do it.
My point was your making trouble for hard working people by publishing things that may or may not be as they seem. THe red trucks again, are entitled to their breaks AND lunch. Do you think they may have gotten food at Shell then taken their lunch hour sitting in the truck? Maybe it would have been out of their way to go back and they stayed on site. IT'S NOT ALWAYS YOUR CONCERN. Did you go to their boss for answers or just blurt out what you think was someone doing wrong when maybe they weren't? Get your facts and answers straight before someone sues you.
4:42 My question was innocent I asked the police chief how many defibulators he had. He also offered that his officers are not trained in First-Aid or CPR.
I believe the question was do the police carry the drug for Heroin overdose? Please find out about Tower 2319 I'll be waiting for your clarification.
Now do you believe police should be trained in CPR and first-aid?
4:49 Why bring this year old item now? Look maybe it's normal for city employee's to hide out to eat lunch/ In 50 years of employment I never "hid-out" to eat lunch. Oh I called the assistant city manager and asked why they were there. If they weren't doing anything wrong what's your problem?
My boss would have never put up with the shanagins some city employees use. Most have never had to work for an employer that had to show a profit. Tell us again the purpose of those electric plant workers again? Trust me in the real world they wouldn't be part of the conversation. Also less than 23% of city employee's live in our fair town.
I bring up the past?
Two places in the Ville' that will never do without electric power Shell and Redi-Go.
hope that guy asks if the police are trained or get the answer it's not my job?
Term have you heard from 4:42 about contacting police and fire?
1`:14 Not yet I am curious how he/she make out?
442 been down & out with the flu. Will post later - gotta run.
5:07 those employees are free to shop at any business they want when on lunch or break. PVille should be happy they chose local.
Mr. Term, how many council meetings have you sat in on? And you never once heard anyone mention a 90 second response? I am sure you HAVE heard response times at past meetings and I am sure you DID NOT hear 90 seconds. Either you need to clean your ears or you need to set the police straight because 90 seconds was NEVER said at a council meeting, therefore you know better and you know his 90 second answer was wrong but you still published it. Why can you not just pick up a phone and ask your questions to the proper people. Is it that hard for you to do? JUST DO IT.
11:37 After the meeting was over in passing I asked the police chief how many defibulators his department had? He said none. I questioned why and he mentioned the emergency crews were 90 seconds away? I guess it doesn't change the fact that they don't have any and are not trained in first-aid or CPR?
I know what I heard. And feel comfortable it was told to me. And you not being there somehow you know?
It takes them that long to get into the squad,start it, and pull out of the station. Then maybe three min. To get there. If your heart has stopped that's enough time to do brain damage. Now most times the police are not even advised that the fire dept. is on a run, unless they request police to be sent. The officers receive training in cpr and first aid , in basic. They also use to carry first aid kits. It is up to the Chief and training officers to keep officer current. I will bet if you check the fire has a first aid trainer and a cpr trainer. So the class to be given within the two depts. I know of several depts that carry AED units. I also know that places like PerrynFire have AED instructors . Seems simple. The only problem is all that cost. Overtime, they can't train during shift.
PPD DOESNT WANT TO BE TRAINED. A former chief said and I quote "NO" and that was why they arent trained. Really? Who needs to be trained on an AED. They are on walls everywhere, instructions walk you through it and it's a no brainer. Defibulators are a different story. Why not ask for PPD to have the AED's it doesnt take a rocket scientist to use them.
Mr. Term, Please think back to the Heisley park conversations with Mr. Flock. EMS times were discussed, times were stated for rescues throughout the entire city at numerous meetings and I never recalled anyone saying a 90 minute response time while I was sitting at council meetings. You like to hear what you want and use what you want instead of the facts that were stated. You just keep defending the wrong person and wrong answer instead of telling the truth here.
1:06 Please read again 90 SECONDS was what I was told. 9 MINUTES was the city stated time to Cobblestone before the bridge opened. That's the truth!
4:42 Happy to report the following. One phone call & several answers…
Along with the information I gathered, I took the liberty to add a few side-bar comments myself.
1. Ninety seconds is NOT correct. 4 1/2 minutes is the average response time. This time has been reported before during council meetings.
2. Auto Zone, NAPA, etc. just don't stock cylinders for fire trucks. Therefore , after a series of unfortunate events and circumstances beyond many people’s control (wrong part sent, ship to wrong location, Sutphin (where parts were to come from) shuts down certain time of the year (Stuff Happens)the truck maintenance found another company to build the parts. Cylinders were installed, truck delivered 2-12-15.
Something I also learned was all aerial trucks are required by NFPA to have annual inspections. This truck passed in 2013. In 2014 the county fire departments contracted with a new inspection company. As a result, a number of aerials in the county failed. From minor to major repairs were found and at least one aerial had to be taken out of service PERMANENTLY. I won’t name drop here, you’ll have to call for that department name. So in the grand scheme of things it wasn’t as bad as the others?
3. Yes, it was in Painesville during the Kensington fire. Could it have been used? No. Why?
1. There is a little piece of paper that is necessary, called a certificate. FD has not gotten this in the mail yet. (again, another hold up, Stuff Happens)Until the certificate arrives the vehicle can be used in the capacity of an engine. AND
2. Even if the certificate had arrived, there was insufficient staff to operate it. As noted in the NH, the crew was already away from the station on a rescue call and saw the "glow in the sky".
4. The drug administered to heroin OD is called Narcan. Yes, EMS does carry it and administer if they have to. PPD does not. To do this would require training, a license to carry it and of course as with all medication in this situation-it has to be under lock and key.
5. AED, no PPD does not have, and the FD has the defibrillator. Take Note -AED’s are many places, malls, schools, health clubs, etc. The big difference-anyone can use an AED-no training needed. That’s why they are there so in an emergency, the machine will walk you through it. ANYONE WITHOUT TRAINING can do this.
For future reference, call440-392-9301 ask the operator for the department you wish to speak, get connected and question away. Now, that was easy. So easy take some effort and do the same next time.
4:42 So where was my misinformation?
The truck was unavailable. police not equipped with AED?
Where is the misinformation?
Narcan for Heroin OD So why was it offered to the PD and by who?
Stuff happens? All to often
90 seconds-for starters. 90 stinking seconds is wrong, wrong wrong. Why can't you admit it? Yes, the time for Cobblestone is longer and was addresses as was the average run time but you still cant get it right that you and police chief are wrong.
3:28 There is a place for saying No and to complain about everything it's called the Tea Party. Next you will want to elect a Canadian born citizen to be President. Show me his Birth Certificate. Birther ANG
3:24 90 seconds 90 years still no CPR or First Aid training.
They dont want it, former chiefs said NO. Maybe you could talk to your bud the new chief to convince him to train his men in this if its so important to you?
But if the 2 of you want to believe it takes 90seconds to for EMS then there truly is no reason to be trained and the rest of us will die waiting at the 91+ seconds time. ANd you'd be the first to complain when they didnt arrive in 90 seconds wouldn't you?
6:51 I have to wonder if it's up to the chiefs? Maybe the Safety Directors call?
I learned a lesson if so one tells you a time period don't state it say in a short time or something like that. If some of you think I believed in the 90 seconds I didn't and either did the chief it was said in a conversation and I apologize for using it.
Only a time period was wrong? I've seen more than one wrong fact here. Look, you backed that statement over and over when people were telling you it was wrong. PPD doesn't want to be trained. There is a differnce between the Sheriff and Painesville police, Sheriff runs over the entire county with several community fire stations within that area. That could be why they have them and PC doesn't.
Does dispatching play into this decision? How would that affect what dispatch has to do? It was really nice when the city had their own dispatchers. Maybe that would be an option so everyone would be on the same page?
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