"BOULEVARD OF OF BROKEN DREAMS" green day
"My shadow's only one that walks with me, through these broken dreams"
I seem to be getting some pushback on the remarks I made at Painesville City Council Meeting Monday night.
I debated saying anything but standing downtown Saturday it struck me. Let's say I had an epiphany None of this will save my town, it's all B#@ls*#t!
While thinking about it could someone please fix the timer on this traffic light at State and Main?
Interesting downtown idea with little or no forethought. What are we trying to accomplish with this?
The Main St. businesses are suffering? No doubt how long again was this project proposed to take?
Look I know a lot of grant money was used and to many grant money is free money. Also some grant money used could have been used for other issues in town and general fund money now to me that's a sin. We are putting fake brick sidewalks in a town where everyone living here or coming here knows we have the worse street's in the county.
$1,300,000 for streetscape, $22,000 a year to help fund the downtown Painesville Organization,. Over seven years that comes to over $150,000 since 2007. And what have we got to show for all this? I know! Fairport wants to try it's hand at this.
Look as I explained at the meeting Painesville consists of more than a Park and two blocks downtown. I guess we must be trying to fool someone?
What causes growth it's simple... JOB'S. Spend some money and or get some people to promote someone coming into the CORE building, a hundred people with jobs will have a more positive result then parallel parking on Main St.
Yes and I also believe a small minority of businesses in town weld more than a little weight with administrators and council. How does spending limited resources downtown benefit Rider's Inn, Steele Mansion, Silvestro's Depot Café? along with many outlining businesses. Even T&T Bakery. Close but not that close.
Maybe we just have a big misunderstanding here? I believe growth will come from improved neighborhoods and others believe growth will come from downtown and out to the neighborhoods.
Mr. Fodor questioned councilman Flock who approached him on the desire to rehabilitate the railroad station? Many did including myself.
"You need a VIABLE DOWNTOWN" really wonder how Mentor get's by?
Oh and I will continue to attend council meeting's
posted by terminator1 @ 3:24 PM
47 Comments
47 Comments:
We should be the ones turning to Fairport for help. Heck they at least have a grocery store. Only one convenient store and no overdose of drugstores. And a beautiful senior center.
As much as I don't understand the grant for Main Street I fail to see why Painesville, the county seat has not hung it's hat on the nursery industry. Why aren't the schools implementing agricultural training for the #1 industry in Lake county. It seems we are stumbling blinding looking for something to hang our hat on and stimulate business. Many living in this city make their living in the industry. Lake county is number 2 in the country for nursery production.
Find a microbrewer and give him a grant to open a business. It worked for abandoned cities in Iowa why not here? Lake county wineries anyone?
I just have a very hard time understanding why this town doesn't have a vision, Streetscapes didn't do a thing for long term businesses with a healthy tax base.
Why not work with established industries already in Lake County? What would entice established business to come here? Do we have an economic think tank in Painesville? Can we work with the business and marketing programs at local colleges for new fresh ideas? I'm tired of beating the same old dead horse.
I support what you said at the council meeting about downtown, and I think there's a lot more of us who share similar sentiments than council members realize. I have to admit, though, that I've not bothered to express my disapproval of Streetscape and other misguided "improvement" projects downtown (remember the crosswalks of red paint?) to my council representative, because I don't think it would do any good. Others I know who think Streetscape was/is a waste, agree; council has proven time and time again that most of their decisions seem to be driven by anything but doing what's best for their constituents, and they're not going to change, no matter how much negative feedback they receive. What's more, they don't have any incentive to change, because they know the odds of being re-elected are heavily in their favor. In fact, the only way a council member would lose was to be regarded on the same level as Hal Werner or Arlene Becks; none of the current bunch are at that level - yet.
Our city council and city leaders filled our city up with illegals, and now just can't figure out what in the world is wrong. Our city already had a bad reputation before that because of some of our citizens -- all the good folks at Argonne Arms, etc. did that. I used to have people tell me they wouldn't come into Painesville BEFORE all the illegals, because of the other citizens, and now, forget it. I have people tell me they drive AROUND Painesville, and won't even drive THROUGH. What's my house worth again? Oh, that's right...almost nothing. But put fake brick on those crosswalks, and keep charging us through the NOSE for our utilities, because you know, that really helps a lot, too. And treat the citizens with total disrespect when they call a council person or the city utility department, or the city manager. Oh, yeah, and go ahead and make it -- what did they want to make it -- a MEXICAN destination, and that will just finish it off. And let's see what else -- the 50% school grading system. It's only got inches to go before it's total crap. On second thought, I just drove home on our broken streets, so I think that really does make it official...it is now total crap. And I personally try to never go anywhere where I have to go through the hassle of parallel parking. And now they have cut down on parking for the businesses and the citizens on the square. As you can tell, I can go on and on and on. Because of the bad reputation some of the citizens and the schools had, I didn't move here until after my children were raised. Then they made the national call for illegals. I wouldn't have bought a home here if I had known what a true piece of garbage this city was. Now everyone does know, and fake brick sidewalks for HOW MUCH MONEY is not going to help.
P.S. Anyone want to buy a house CHEAP?
Just sayin', there's no such thing as free money. It all comes from the tax PAYERS pockets.
I guess all I can say is it's my belief council still believes this downtown is a worthwhile endeavor. You have to politely explain that you don't believe it is.
8:04pm, Katie is pretty near that level.
8:23pm, just rent your house out to 50 illegals at $100 per week and you can afford to go anywhere. That's what other landlords are doing. And the rest of us have to look at backyards turned into campgrounds in the summer and parking lots for all their cars with temp tags on it. How is it that the same car just keeps having new temp tags?
I admit I'm not that familiar with the streetscape concept, but supposed experts in urban planning claim they're successful in turning around once stagnant business districts into viable centers. Maybe it won't work in downtown Painesville because it's too far gone (?)
Frankly, the comments above (8:23) about Mexicans are more than bordering on racist. In many cities and towns across the country Mexican immigrants (and yes, illegal immigration is a contentious issue; though obviously many ARE indeed here legally) have, if anything brought new life back to ailing local economies. There was an article about a month ago in the NH about how really Painesville should exploit the Mexican presence into an ethnic attraction for outsiders, as a way of promoting tourism. Painesville has ALWAYS been a diverse community, and with that come some urban-style problems. It sound like you just want a lily-white suburb. You should move.
Checking rumor about Harvey Football coach. Waiting for the administration.
Also it seems the administration and the city are reaching an agreement for an SRO officer at Heritage Middle. A needed addition to that school.
10:24 Everyone needs a scapegoat, I wonder what this city would look like without the Hispanic population. Some would tell you great and believe it. Others would tell you it would be a ghost town, and believe it. Me? There here let's make the best of the situation for all of us.
Look at council look at the administration, look at the Downtown Facebook photos? What you wish and what you have are two different things.
8:45 The things you mentioned can be cured. We even have ordinances to take care of them.
You really have to ask how Mentor does it? THEY HAVE BUSINESS. INCOME. PROPERTY of VALUE. THEY ARE BIGGER THAN WE. Anything else? No comparison with them and us. Like a grape to a watermelon.
Wineries? Arent they supposed to begin growing them on Fairport Nursery Rd. Old Diamond property. I heard that a long time ago, good think I don't like wine.
Spot on 8:23 have heard the same comments over and over, year after year. 10:24 border racial comment? I agree with that person and Im sick of being accused of being a racist because I am the only race that cant say anything about another. Blacks and Mexicans continually call us that, so if the shoe fits it should go both ways not one sided. Term your comment you wonder what it would be like without the Mex. population and we should make the best of the situation? That's not what you were saying when past certain council people supported HOLA and that debacle. You did not support what was said or done now you think we should make the best of it? You are off your rocker man.
12:10 My problem was always with the leader of HOLA. Look what can a city council do to support or be against the people who have located here? The feds and State do nothing what should Painesville do? Along with the fact that people YOU elected asked them to come here. We can't even repair streets and you expect what and who to do what?
11:58 I know all that my point was Mentor get's by without a downtown, that's all. Along with the fact that we have fewer grapes to take care of.
Why does every comment here turn into a race issue?
There not leaving your not leaving so what are we going to do but complain?
Yes, let's not mention that the town is filled with illegal Mexicans when we are trying to figure out what is wrong, and why nobody wants to come here. Or that the city has had a bad reputation for it's other citizens for decades. Our schools had bad enough reputations before the 50% policy and the children of illegals. What is the percentage of Hispanic kids in our elementary school now? Mostly Hispanic? People who live in America actually want it to be America and not a Hispanic country with Hispanic cities, so even if they don't want to come here now because of the double whammy - (trust me, this town didn't need another reason for a bad reputation), we have to make sure that we don't mention it, even if it is the truth. It's just like the entire country can't afford health care, but we are paying for MILLIONS -- PROBABLY 40 MILLION -- illegals to have free health care. But you don't want to bring that up when you're having any kind of discussion -- and we DON'T bring it up -- because that would be racist. It's the truth. Our town is overrun by illegals, and it matters. And bringing it up doesn't mean that every discussion on this blog ends up to be racist. It's a fact. Ignoring it isn't going to change the fact that that is what it is; it's getting worse all the time; and it matters to people. I didn't do it or make it this way, so don't blame me. Painting things can't cover that up. What can be done about it? Probably nothing now. It's probably too late, but it's a fact, and it's the truth, and it matters.
Term
"The things you mentioned can be cured. We even have ordinances to take care of them."
You know me and I agree with why you wrote. However, as we both know, getting the people in charge (specifically someone who is retiring) to do their job is not possible. They seem to worry more about sheds and swimming pools.
Mr. Fodor questioned councilman Flock who approached him on the desire to rehabilitate the railroad station? Many did including myself.
Actually, Councilman Fodor asked Councilman Flock who's idea was it. His own or someone else.
I noticed Mr. Flock was unable to answer without first looking to you for a nod of approval. In fact, that happened more than once. I'm certain Flock will be glad to hear his puppet master will not be abandoning him at council meetings.
I don't believe anyone is talking about the real problem in this downtown. It is quite simple, we are the county seat and Lake County government does nothing to mitigate that harm to our downtown.
When you are the county seat and all social services are located in your downtown you also draw in a larger share of low income that what a normal city should support. Why is that bad?, because stores locate into areas where they have an abundance of disposable income to rely on. Painesville has an abundance of SSI, $650 a month income in our downtown area.
How much of our downtown is County related and ends up locking the doors and rolling up the carpets every night at 5pm.
Do I want to get rid of the county?, not really but they should start showing restraint in how much of our viable downtown property they continue to suck up. The county should also be policing the distribution of social services better, ask them what percent of LCMHA or Extended housing is in Painesville compared to the rest of the county.Studies have proven for the last twenty years that putting all housing of this type in one area is the worst thing you can do for people, yet the first apartment complex built outside of Painesville (Willoughby has it) just happened about 2 years ago.
Nooooo, you also had a huge problem with Delamotte and Horvath. It wasn't only HOLA. You were up & calling for their resignation/don't reelect.
Where to start
1:21 First off Mrs. Delamotte went on national TV and welcomed legal as well as illegals to settle in Painesville. Using and mentioning her position as Painesville council-at-large. Mr. Horvath wrote a letter to Senator Mike DeWine expressing how the people of Painesville had welcomed all these illegals to there town. Mr. Horvath was President of council and there was never a discussion at a council meeting about sending that letter. In my view he was speaking for all of us without venting this in a public meeting. Mrs. Delamotte now she got her response and after arriving we're complaining but not to her but to the people that took up her offer.
5:35 You points are all valid. That's why it's important to keep many county offices in the city. (Health Dept.)Wonder if those Laketran drivers pay city income tax?
7:51 Puppetmaster? Look we discussed the train station many times , should go to a town hall meeting you might learn something. Could it be that Mr. Flock didn't want to bring me into this? I pointed to Mr. Fodor I was one of the people to bring it up. Along with spending some time with the people presently trying to save the station. Many issues such as AMP-OHIO Streetscape both of us agree on. Along with many times believing he's the only person on council using common sense and caring about how the city spends it's money. Do I consider him a friend/ Yes, does he do my biding? Hardly. Do we both think saving that station as important/ Yes.
10:24, this is 8:23: So you are one of the ones who seem to just accept that with a diverse urban community, you will have a higher crime rate. Nobody can bring up that fact except for you, however, because even though it's the truth, it's racist to say it. And it has mattered to this city's reputation for decades. And now we have a city full of illegals. Term thinks we don't have to blame the illegals at all because, you know, just like the "urban" people, it's somebody else's fault when they break the law. But the discussion is about why this town is failing, and why no one wants to come here. The biggest answer is the "urban" reputation/problem and the illegals/Mexicans. It's a fact. Go ask around the other cities what they think of Painesville. They will tell you THAT. And just because you seem to be someone who screams RACISM every time a white person opens their mouth or looks at a black or Hispanic, it doesn't take away the fact that those two reasons are the main reasons that this city has a bad reputation. It's the elephant in the room that no one mentions, because they don't want to be called a racist. Maybe more lily-white people ought to open their mouths now, especially because the blacks and Hispanics are telling the whole world that we are the ones that are racist, and not them, when nothing could be further from the truth. You can talk around the elephants in this town all you want, but that is the biggest problem people have with this town, and there is just no way to get around it. You can NOT talk about it all you want, and call it racist to do so, but it doesn't change the facts.
Who owns the rail station property and building?
4:48 How do we change the facts?
4:48
I have lived in Painesville since the late 50's. My brothers and sisters have all moved to different parts of the country but I stayed right here. Call me lazy, stupid, or whatever you want but it is home for me.
Painesville has changed a great deal during my life but it is not the fault of blacks, hispanics, or any other racial or ethnic group. It relates specifically to the white majority who controlled the City in the 60's.
They are the folks who changed the zoning in this town to allow multiple family dwelling almost everywhere.
They are the ones who demolished the blocks downtown without having a plan in place for what would replace those buildings.
They are the ones who chased all the auto dealerships (and other businesses) out of town.
They are the folks who chose not to spend any money on road maintenance.
The list goes on and on.
Now we have an Administration and a Council that took a LONG time to come up with a definition of "family" that suits no one and yet offends no one. After all, if the rules are made purposely vague, the City can either ignore them or say things like "four unrelated people, in a house, constitutes a family".
They can selectively enforce building and zoning codes as they wish because no one really knows what they mean.
This is NOT the fault of blacks or Hispanics who live here. It comes back to a Council that doesn't give direction to the Administration and an Administration that pushes for rules they want by leaning on Council.
We have a relatively new Council and that makes it easier for the Administration to push their agenda. After all, new people don't want to rock the boat and appear out of step.
Don't like what you see, VOTE for new people on Council. That is the only way change can possibly occur.
Don't make everything a racial issue. We had plenty of problems in this City before the Hispanic population came here.
The real question is, what can we do to make things better going forward?
8:27 I guess we're in the same boat? Love the place can't really put it into words.
Yes many mistakes made in the last 50 plus years and we just can't find a solution. Yes we can blame it on just about anybody, but the truth is it's really our fault. The apathy in this town is overwhelming why I haven't A CLUE. People ask me constantly what are you trying to accomplish? I don't know maybe people to challenge the status quo? Heck I would be happy if someone went to a council meeting and rebuffed my comments. At least I would know someone was paying attention. I guess IS anyone paying attention? than again I guess we get what we deserve.
I think this one sentence pretty much sums up the main problem of why Painesville is suffering (8:27)--
"They are the ones who demolished the blocks downtown without having a plan in place for what would replace those buildings. "
I grew up in the 60's when this so-called urban renewal plan was concocted. Wasn't Dale Helsel the city manager? (his son was in my class) I don't know how much input he had directly into all the destruction downtown, but it seemed fashionable at the time to blame him, along with city council. Let's face it, we were desperate because the Great Lakes Mall was the new center of retail in Lake County and suburban-style living was all the craze, with sprawl coming from Cleveland. Who could fight that and win? Still, there was no need to destroy so many buildings. At least today Painesville would have more of an historic feel than it does, and that could have been an attraction in itself. Thank goodness its not even worse!
Also agree that to blame blacks and Hispanics for Painesville's problems is despicable. Re: 4:48 AM's comment "Go ask around the other cities what they think of Painesville." Huh? What cities? You mean those all white suburbs that have had segregated housing policies which is why their schools have no people of color. And give me a break that racism doesn't exist. I remember even in the 60's the kind of racist remarks coming from Riverside students and wondering do live in Mississippi or Ohio?? I guess it still exists! Maybe there is a little too much hypersensitivity to the concept of racism these days, but based on the comments of 4:48 AM it's easy to understand why!
Term 7:39. Your point is mute. This has nothing to do with changing the facts. It has to do with the realization that these are the facts and a large part of why the city is failing. When trying to figure out what is wrong, with everyone wringing their hands and trying this and that, nobody mentions the elephants in the room as if they don't exist when they clearly do, and everyone from here, and from the surrounding areas, knows it. Do a little research, and ask people outside the city what they think of Painesville, and if they would ever move here, and if not, why not.
10:29 We have to blame someone or some group for the decline of our city. Let's remember they
promoted Argonne Arms, the urban renewal policy, the ordinances that pretty much drove business out of the city, I forgot did they build all of these apartments? That elephant some speak about pasted then ignored all those ordinances over the last 20 years. Yep them Blacks did all this!
8:39 To agree with you means that wise people shouldn't invest another dime in Painesville? Streetscape is a farce? Should we leave? Go quietly into the night? Many have.
re 8:39 pm "Do a little research, and ask people outside the city what they think of Painesville, and if they would ever move here, and if not, why not."
"Okay, Martha, lock the doors! We have to drive through Painesville! If we're lucky we won't get carjacked...again. I'm glad we installed those bulletproof windows, though. Just in case, kids, I want you to duck down in the event we end up in the crossfire of a gang shooting!"--LOL
9:38 I think you forgot the snipers on the roofs, don't forget the IED's (never mind it's just our normal streets) Thoughts like these explain why we don't show certain movies...FEAR
Martha your one lucky woman!
I don't think Martha's going to the movies this week either.
Please tell me your figures are wrong? Over a million dollars for that project, how do they get that $22,000 every year?
WHo is going to pay for this railroad station fixerup? Maybe someone should have a bake sale.
10:08 Maybe we should look outside the box. Mentor just got money from the state to repair their old city hall. Money's out there maybe a corporate sponsor or a private individual.
You will not find a better train station between Buffalo and Cleveland. My fear is it gets to the point it's repairable.
So, take money from the state, where would the state get it from? They will steal from Peter to pay Paul - either way it comes from OUR pockets and someone will have to do without somewhere else. Priorities, pick the most needed projects. Look at the Unionville Tavern, people have put their money where their mouth is to save it. All you train folk should do the same here. Just sayin.
12:50 You can look at it that way if you wish. Ohio is going to spend X amount of dollars , Peter is going to pay someone. Typical Painesville, it seems everyone is more deserving than us? The idea of saving an historical building is quite different than how we just screwed up Main St.
Many times on Railroad St. I see numerous people from out of town taking pictures of the train station. Who's taking pictures of our new Main St.
Truth be told Painesville needs a Grant writer who works just on commission of a percentage of the grants they receive. Department directors? Direct not write grants.
The first step in saving an historic building is knowing what it will cost. Does anyone have that amount?
6:09 Maybe the first step is there a desire in Painesville to save this building?
Who owns ownership? What are their plans.
Maybe this is just another phase of something else missing in town every time you turn around?
Yes the money will be spent regardless but there are hundreds of in "need" for those funds, not just want. You don't seem concerned at all with the money lost from the drain the illegals put on all taxpaying citizens but the concern over an abandoned home on the avenue and abandoned RR station really confuses and concerns me.
1:17 Interesting how you can turn saving a building into an immigration issue.
I wonder how many times in the last year you used the services of one of these illegals "indirectly"?
Maybe you didn't even know? Someone staffed by a motel, lawns service food service ect.
I guess since neither political parties and there leadership see's nothing wrong with this going on, I guess it will continue and we still will have to contend with those buildings?
I guess you can blame the illegals for coming after you leave the door open with a welcome sign on it. (Reagan. Bush, Clinton, Bush and Obama)
The only pipe line anyone is interested in is Keystone, and those folks thank you for your support in getting those whores elected. Speaking of whores how would our congress vote on this issue? Put it up for a vote is that asking to much? Find out in your own eyes who would rather have them here than a building saved. Seems I know the answer and you don't.
Even in this season of brotherly love some how you tied this all together.
Hit the nail on the head Term, if its the tea party, liberty coalition rally team whatever, the GOP only provides lip services.
It's almost comical to watch these misguided people believe they are getting anywhere.
The solution is when you speak with your congressman, senator even presidential candidate bring a BIG bag of cash. Keep the flags at home. Money, Money, Money. You would have thought they would have been smart enough to figure it out by now?. Rater these nitwits complain to you. Sad
3:23 I guess I don't understand either. I could be on this blog. 24/7 everyday railing against illegals and not one illegal would be deported. I guess they need this spot to vent.
Also many times they refer to politicians being against the will of the people?
You would believe that if it was truly the will of the people they would do something?
Also I believe the whole U.S. government has done the math and needs these people here to finance the country.
Money is the factor 1:17 group doesn't possess and let's face it it's what Washington runs on.
This along with the GOP doing everything they can to get more money into candidate and party coffers I see know change in the future. I guess the people in charge assume we will make lemonade out of lemons?
3:04, your statement to 1:17 wondering how many times they indirectly used the services of an illegal really just proves 1:17's point. If those illegals weren't there, then the services would have been provided by an American. Americans have always done the jobs that the illegals do, and they would do them again. (Except for the field work only. There are Americans who want those jobs, too, but we have always needed guest workers to do the lion's share.) We seemed to be able to handle that situation for decades until now. But every other job has an American waiting for it.
6:47 No, I believe 1:17 made my point. As long as corporations and even small businesses fund either or both political party's you will not see any legislation towards 1:17 argument. Sorry. They want the cheap labor as well as customers. Enjoy the lip service though!
7:58, this is 6:47. You are completely off topic. My only point was that you are wondering how many times we Americans indirectly use the services of the illegals, as if we should be grateful. The fact is, if we are using the services of an illegal, then we are using the services of someone who has taken an American job. If that illegal was not here, an American would have that job, and there would be no need to be stupidly grateful to an illegal in our country.
3:11 Who mentioned being grateful?
I am starting to understand how you think. It makes no difference to you who or why they are here even to the point it really a mystery of it happening? Now you just want them gone and hold no on responsible. But them? So we can do this proceass over and over again.
They ain't going anywhere.
I got it 6:47- both comments made sense to me, 1:17. Some people only have a one-track-mind and will never concede should they be mistaken, or will argue with you every time until you realize you can't argue with them anymore.
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